We all know that Labour is in turmoil just now - and it's going to get worse round about the 24th of July. The Lib Dems have played copycat to Labour by having a lack of leaders in Scotland and Lib Dem members have now decided they fancy a bit of turmoil too. I refer you to the very informative online Lib Dem discussion website Liberal Democrat Voice, and in particular to the page about the bye-election in Glasgow East.
There are some interesting posts there from Lib Dem members talking about the Lib Dems losing significant numbers of seats to the Conservatives come the next election (probably right) and others arguing that the Lib Dems should now dump their current positions and volte-face to seek to win seats from Labour (what, no principle involved?)
Here's a wee selection of Lib Dem comments - I have, of course, edited them to pick out the bits I like best:
ash Says: 29th June 2008 at 12:00 amGood to see that at least one Lib Dem member dislikes the way their party orders its affairs.
Dan says;
We stand and we fight. We’re a political party seeking political power FFS. It’s what political parties do.
True. But doesn’t it need to be done for a purpose? I know this party has beliefs and principles but we present ourelves as an “anything for a vote” bunch of opportunists with all the “winning here” and bogus bar chart stuff.
Anonymous Says: 28th June 2008 at 11:42 pm
At the moment, the party, as represented on these boards - which I hope to God isn’t the same thing as the party in reality - is giving the impression of a bunch of people who want to be elected, casting around for the “message” - any “message” - that will get them elected.
Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose ...
Sesenco Says: 28th June 2008 at 11:14 pm
Glasgow East presents a number of difficulties.
There are few Lib Dem activists in the region, and I can’t imagine too many coachloads of English members making the trip there. The constituency is a collection of rather grotty 1950s and 1960s council estates with high levels of crime and anti-social behaviour. Sectarianism, class hatred and Anglophobia are rife. It is not a very safe or pleasant place to run a byelection campaign (especially for those who have English accents).
Is this really what Lib Dem members think? That if a constituency has a few areas where straw boaters are uncommon then it can't possibly be worth bothering about the people who live there?
Douglas Says: 28th June 2008 at 11:02 pm
In by-elections we usually get by on a variation of “we are not the government”. At national elections this hasn’t worked.
Surely a political party should have more to say than "we're quite fluffy"?
Anonymous Says: 28th June 2008 at 4:14 pm
Get real - we can’t win this.
...
I’d prefer us to start spending the serious money currently being thrown on hopeless by-election campaigns in reinforcing and defending our current crop of seats that are under considerable threat from the Tories.
...
If we don’t re-focus, I believe we risk overstretch - with the result that we will lose a large batch of Lib Dem / Tory marginals and still fail to capitalise on Labour weaknesses where we are in a close second.
This is the ‘meltdown’ scenario that I fear we are sleep-walking into by pretending the political backdrop has not substantially changed in the last year.
...
I, for one, am totally fed up with being told - by email, text and through the post - that we can win everywhere there just happens to be an election and all we need is a final push, another leaflet, more people etc etc, when it should be clear we simply can’t.
Look at that - honesty from a Lib Dem who knows that they'll be losing seats right across England to the Conservatives come the election. They'll also be losing Scottish seats to the SNP.
Tez Burke Says: 28th June 2008 at 4:08 pm
It’s time to get real. Run a paper candidate and tacitly back the SNP. We haven’t a hope in hell here and any amount of bar-charting and “winning here” rhetoric from Cowley Street is going to backfire even more spectacularly than C&N
What can I say?
C Davison Says: 28th June 2008 at 3:38 pm
Go through the motions. It’s obvious this is a two horse race and we ain’t one of the horses.
We’d just compound the problems that are surrounding the ramping up strategy if we went down the ‘Winning here’ route. Besides we only got 8% and 6% in the Scottish Parliament seats in 2007 that make up this constituency. We’d be ignored or laughed at.
Neigh bother!
Douglas Says: 28th June 2008 at 2:54 pm
I would put a minimal effort into to be honest.
Just as the Lib Dems are being squeezed by the Tories in England, the SNP in Scotland are the dominant political force. We offer nothing against them and unfortunately Nicol Stephen comes accross as an over-promoted school head-boy.
Let the SNP & Labour fight it out and watch from a safe distance.
What a cruel thing to say about Nicol Stephen! I'm shocked that a member of his own party can be so forthright about him.
Anonymous Says: 28th June 2008 at 2:34 pm
Can we not get someone to stand on a point of principle that we agree with, and thereby avoid standing and (possibly) losing our deposit?
It's all about the money, it's all about the dum dum.
And I don't think it's funny
(with apologies to Meja)
Anon2 Says: 28th June 2008 at 2:31 pm
After Henley, spend about a tenner on it.
Oops!
So there you have it - Labour gets rid of its Scottish leader, the Lib Dems get rid of theirs, Labour descends into chaos, the Lib Dems follow. We can only hope that the good people prevail and the dodgy bar graphs and "winning here" guff goes out the window - let's see some honest campaigning from the Lib Dems.
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